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Who is your favorite disc jockey? If you ask anyone over 35 they're apt to name
Wolfman Jack or Don Imus, or even Murray The K or Dewey Phillips. Of course, they
were memorable (and Imus is still going strong). Wolfman Jack's voice and the
mischievous aura around it captivated a generation, and the cutting wit of Imus,
the enthusiasm of Murray and the zaniness of Dewey attracted legions of fans who
couldn't wait to turn on the radio and hear these men work. The sad truth
is that if you ask most kids that same question, they'll just stare at you and
try to remember a name that matters.
Radio, for the most part, has been a wasteland for the past two decades, thanks to deregulation opening the door for a few huge corporations to buy up all the stations. Corporate mentality means one thing: the bottom line is the only line. Surveys were slanted towards various consumer demographics and the stations were run by the letter of those surveys. There were two casualties: the real radio personalities and, as a result, the real radio fans. Not the employer who allows an easy listening station for background music in the workplace, and not the little girls who just want to hear the same ten songs over and over while they read teen idol magazines, but the real fans who felt like part of the story when they listened to their favorite stations. How sad it is that we've lost that.
One of the disk jockeys that people loved to tune into was Quincy McCoy, a true
radio personality who has been part of many great stations including the legendary
Y-100 in south Florida. Over the course of his 30 years in the radio and record
business, McCoy has seen enough to know what works and what doesn't, what's good
and what's bad, and he seems to know how to fix it. His book, NO STATIC, recently
released by Miller-Freeman, spells it out in plain English for all to see. His
current position as a writer for Gavin, THE trade magazine for the radio industry,
should prove his credibility to the corporate types who have the power to "fix it,"
but the trend continues into the new century. In the end it will come down to what
we, the listeners, choose to listen to. How can we bring back the spark? Let's
start by gaining an understanding of how we lost it in the first place. We certainly
asked the right person.
Cosmik: What happened? Why do we only have safe radio?
McCoy: Part of it is called the "liner card mentality." What happened was research. Radio became very, very dependent on research. See, research works in a lot of different, evil ways. For the bottom line, all of a sudden, radio station operators didn't have to deal with big name personalities and spend a lot of money, because the research said "hey, just play these 30 records over and over again and you'll get all the [listeners] that you need. Once that happened, the search for big named personalities and talent in the country seemed to cease.
Cosmik: When did that happen?
McCoy: This all happened around the late 70s, early 80s, when this "more music less talk" thing kind of kicked in. What happened was we lost generation after generation of air personalities because there was no place for these people to work on their craft. And creative program directors didn't really have a place to work on what they did, a place to make mistakes, grow, and get better like in the old system of radio. In the old system of radio, before consolidation and deregulation took over, radio station people were able to work in small markets, then medium markets, then major markets, and everybody was exploring their personalities and experimenting. Now we don't have laboratory stations anymore, so we don't have a place for people to grow and for the craft to become better.
Cosmik: I remember back in my high school years, when our radio stations were a mix of personalities, people actually had a feeling of loyalty to their favorite station.
McCoy: Fierce loyalty. When was the last time you couldn't wait to turn the radio on to hear a radio station?
Cosmik: 1979.
[Pictured: Chuck Leonard]
McCoy: Yeah, exactly. That's what I'm talking about. That's what happened. We
used to have great lineups of personalities, one day part after another. Now,
most of the money is spent on having someone on morning drive - usually a lot of
that's syndicated now - and so you don't have your local personalities sprouting
and growing and becoming names in the community. That's the downside of it. I
can remember tremendous lineups of personalities like WABC in New York where you'd
have Harry Harrison in the morning followed by Ron Lundy followed by Dan Ingram followed
by Cousin Brucie followed by Chuck Leonard followed by whoever the all-night
guy was. But it was one after another after another after another of great
personalities, and every radio station was doing that. Every one of those guys
had their own unique act and following, and still, at the same time, the personality
of the radio station itself was consistent, because they had great program directors
to work with those personalities. These guys could be themselves, be the
personalities, but at the same time they carried along the basic brand of what the
radio station was all about. That's when radio stations were great.
Cosmik: So it's also about creative recruiting.
McCoy: There was plenty of great recruiting in those days, and we had places to go look for people. There were smaller markets like New Haven, Connecticut. A lot of talent came out of there. A lot of talent came out of Jacksonville in the south and worked their way into Charlotte and places like that. People were always looking and talking about personalities and air checks were flying all over the place. It's not the same anymore. The passion for creating a great radio station is not there anymore, because with consolidation, these companies that own all these radio stations have a high debt load to pay. They have Wall Street investors, and they're so bottom line focused that the last thing they're interested in is entertaining the audience, which is what radio was all about.
Cosmik: But weren't surveys used back in the good old days, too?
McCoy: Yes.
Cosmik: What's the difference between surveys then and surveys now?
McCoy: Oh, there's no difference between surveys then and surveys now. The difference is in the mentality of the people that are running the stations. A lot of the stations were owned by single people, like John Clukey or Cecil Heftel. These guys were broadcasters. That's what they considered themselves. So they had an interest in having their radio stations be excellent in what they did. Now, when you have a lot of companies that are owned by guys that run banks and insurance companies, and a lot of that stuff happened in the early 80s when the first wave of consolidation came through, all they cared about was the bottom line. Guys literally would come in from companies and say "why do we pay this guy in the morning so much more than we pay the guy in the afternoon?" They wouldn't understand that the morning guy was vital to the radio station. You know, "so goes the morning, so goes the rest of the day," as the philosophy goes, which is true. But they don't understand that, and if you can't understand that little concept of radio, how are you going to understand anything else? So what happens is they become cookie cutter about everything. They say "we're going to pay everybody $35,000 and that's it." The big name personalities can't exist on that, so they move on to wherever they move on to, or they move on to no place at all. Now we have a situation where we only have big name personalities in the morning, there is no big name guy, or woman, in the afternoon, it's just the same people reading the same slogans over and over and over. The research thing is so predominate in this country that you can go from city to city and see the same thing: you see a "Hot," a "Kiss," a "Power." That's what they call the stations from market to market to market. The average person doesn't even realize that there are four major groups out there that own almost all the radio stations in the country. Ten, fifteen years ago you had small, minority ownership, small business guys that owned fifteen or twenty stations, but it's not like that anymore. These groups own four hundred stations, seven hundred stations... It's just ridiculous.
Cosmik: When I lived in Los Angeles in the 80s, my favorite station was KMET, The Mighty MET. The jocks had distinctive personalities and it was fun to listen. Then they fired all of them and replaced them with recordings of people having breakfast conversation about nothing. It was sickening. Was that kind of thing a doomed experiment from the start?
McCoy: I remember when that happened because I was working for the company that actually did that. It was MetroMedia. I was in New York, and I was in a corporate meeting - this is one of the meetings that got me in a lot of trouble - and they were sitting there, the research guy and the president of the company, and I distinctly remember them saying "well, we're going to take all the personalities off the air and run banners around the town saying 'more music and NO disc jockeys'." I said "wait a minute. This station has been in the community for a long time and has a lot of loyal listeners. Do you mean to tell me you're going to put billboards up that say "no disc jockeys? Do you know how inhumane that's going to sound?" They thought I was crazy. I got really nasty looks that day, and it got me in trouble later on. When it happened, the backlash was immense. The Los Angeles newspapers went crazy, and the people took the side of the disc jockeys, who were out there protesting, and inside was this automation machine going round and round with these stupid drops of so-called "real people" conversations going on. These people didn't realize that the most important thing in radio is that it's what's between the records that counts. Everybody can play the same records, but the personalities between the records is what made the stations great.
Cosmik: I remember when music was enthusiastically played for us, and now I don't hear it at all. Do you think today's disc jockeys have taken on the same cookie cutter mentality as the companies have?
McCoy: There's no passion for the music anymore. The audience has passion, but I think a lot of the disc jockeys today have grown up without any of that passion. The opening part of my book is about how I feel sorry for these so-called personalities because these people have never experienced the kind of feeling and camaraderie that I felt, and the kind of passion I had for the business and the music. For being on the radio. For entertaining. It was all about being on there and performing. I think if you said "performing" to a lot of these guys they wouldn't get it; they'd say "well I can read these liners perfectly. I make no mistakes when I say 'more music, less talk.'" One of the great quotes in my book is from a guy who said something like "you know, guys are on the radio just saying 'more music, less talk," and they're never going to be standing in line at McDonalds and have some kid tap them on the shoulder and excitedly say 'hey!! You're the guy that says more music, less talk!! Fifteen in a row!! I heard you the other day!! That was great!!'" It's not gonna happen. But I remember in the old days the kids would follow the station vans, they'd follow you in your car, they wanted to know where you lived, all because you were really performing, doing your job, and entertaining the people.
Cosmik: When the real personalities would come out on stage to introduce the bands at huge concerts, people would go crazy and yell and clap because they were excited to be seeing that person in the flesh.
[Pictured: Don Imus]
McCoy: I remember Scott Muni coming out at a concert for Lynyrd Skynyrd. I was with Muni,
who was a big drinker back in those days, and Muni was late getting there so the show was
about an hour late and the audience was getting antsy. But the band would not go on until
Muni showed up. So Muni shows up, and we walk in there, Scott walks out on the stage and
the place erupts! They went bananas! He says "I'm Scott Muni from.." and firecrackers
are going off! I remember Frankie Crocker coming out in front of a show in Madison
Square Garden and just saying "I'm Frankie Crocker" and [makes cheering sounds]! One of
the interesting correlations to this is guys like Howard Stern, Doug Banks, Tom Joiner,
Don Imus, these guys are syndicated are very powerful and on a lot of stations, and do you
know why? Because they're very talented at what they do. And do you know why? Because
they all started BEFORE the liner card mentality took over. These guys were all coming
up in the 60s and 70s learning their craft. That's why they're better than all the other
guys out there right now, and that's why they're on all these different stations out there.
Because they ARE entertainers and they do a hell of a job.
Cosmik: So now if they're so successful doing the opposite of the liner card mentality, why don't the powers that be see that?
McCoy: I ask that question in my book because I've looked at a lot of businesses that have consolidated over the years and I noticed a pattern. You can look at any magazine, like Fast Company or any of those great modern-day dot-com magazines, and you see one thing that all the businesses recognized: talent. They knew talent was the answer for them to be successful. A big talent hunt goes on at all these businesses, they're always stealing from one another, always looking for the new kid on the block, and they're using talent because they know that's the answer. Radio, for some reason, still doesn't get it. Though they may be starting to. In my book I talk about how I went to a succession of National Broadcasting Association meetings, and there's always the big five or the big six or however many are left at the time that are up there talking. I remember the one in New Orleans where they were talking about how "it's a bottom line business now, get all the personality out of it." The next year I go back, all of a sudden it's "well, we need to add more fun to what we're doing." Because they're starting to come around and think "oh, this was a big mistake." You've gotta have fun. In the old days radio stations were fun. When you really loved a station, you were afraid you'd be missing something that was going on. You couldn't wait to turn it on and see "what the hell happened? What did I miss?" You wanted to see what your favorite personality was up to. There's not much of that at all anymore. There are some great disc jockeys out there still, performing around the country, but overall, radio has lost that edge.
Cosmik: And they've lost the loyalty of listeners in the process.
McCoy: Research shows that all kids today, ages 12 to 24, are not checking for radio at all because it's not cutting edge. There's nothing there that they want to know about. Are your daughters dying to turn the radio on?
Cosmik: Just the 12 year old, but she's hooked into the N-Sync mentality. She listens to a station that plays the same 10 or 15 records over and over.
McCoy: Ah, but is she crazy about the radio station or just the occasional N-Sync song?
Cosmik: I don't think she cares about the station except when they give away records.
McCoy: See, you have a little bit of that, but the Internet has a lot more intrigue now, or games, or Walkman, or CD players. You get a family in a car on a road trip, and nobody's fighting over control of the radio because they've got their own little CD players in the back seat and they're playing what they want to hear.
Cosmik: Kind of ironic that the Internet is involved in that equation, because it just might be the one place we'll find great radio again. I find a lot of wonderful stations on the Net broadcasting in streaming audio. Do the powers that be feel threatened by this?
McCoy: Oh no, they don't feel threatened at all. They think because radio is free they have an edge and always will. It's like network television thinking cable was never going to go anywhere because people wouldn't pay for it. Radio people are falling into that same trap and they're going to get out-programmed by a bunch of smart kids out there. At the Gavin convention a lot of people were on the panel talking about this, and this is in my book, too. One guy, a great consultant and radio programmer named Bill Tanner said "have you ever noticed how funny the great commercials on TV are these days? Every time I see one, I say to myself 'that guy was going to be in radio.'" He said "we've lost a lot of talent to other mediums because radio used to be attractive to people, and they're not going there anymore." I always thought that was an interesting and telling comment. A lot of us feel that there are a lot of smart, creative kids out there are going to start some incredible Internet radio stations that are just going to kick the hell out of the regular commercial band.
Cosmik: When rock and roll was dying in the mid 70s, punk came in with a DIY [do it yourself] mentality and all these young kids totally juiced things up again and made things interesting for years after. The Net has a DIY mentality now because anyone can broadcast. Do you think that's healthy in the same way?
McCoy: Yeah, I do. The more the merrier, as far as I'm concerned. I can't wait for this
broadband, when it gets easier, and better sounding, too. That's when the revolution is
really going to happen. I see now where a bunch of radio guys have gotten together and
formed these little dot-com clicks of stations they're going to put on, and a lot of stations
are streaming what they already do on the radio. That's not going to do any good. That's
not going to attract anyone. If you're going to come on there, you're going to have to come
on with something different. It's a great place for radio to experiment and try some new
things, see if they work, and put those things back on the radio stations. Some guys are
going to do that. Some smart guys are going to get out there and use their Internet stations
as a place to experiment. You can do a lot of contests, you can do a lot of album cuts and
music you wouldn't play on the other station, watch it take off, and apply it back to what
you're doing on the regular radio stations to make change. I'm hoping that people will start
doing that, but right now I'm just seeing a lot of streaming, and I've seen a lot of guys
who have lousy ideas that are just bringing the same lousy ideas and putting them on the
Internet. And nothing's ever going to happen for them, because no one is going to be
interested in going to a station like that. I think that's the problem. These guys just
don't get it.
Cosmik: I'd say nine out of ten of the stations available on the Net right now are exactly the same thing you've already got on every slot on the dial in your town. But one thing I do see is great community and college stations that are streaming. A lot of us don't have a great community station to listen to, but through the Net we can get this globally.
McCoy: That's true. That's what I like about this.
Cosmik: You talk a lot about community stations in your book.
McCoy: Oh, I think community service is what separates the men from the boys when you're on the commercial level. Anybody who really understands the problems of the community can help, because radio has such great reach and frequency, they're really doing their job. That's where you get people to remember who you are. We have so many problems today, aids, violence in the schools, you can take any one of those subjects and concentrate on it. Those are some of the things I've worked on at some of my stations in the past. Stop The Violence Day. We used to have people bring in the guns, and we'd pay them 200 bucks for a gun with no questions asked. We'd get the cops down there with us and just collect all the guns. It's just amazing, and people remember you. I remember buying up a billboard that always had liquor or cigarette ads on it. We bought the billboard and put something like "Normally there's a liquor or cigarette ad up here, so we thought we'd take this space just to clear your head and tell you to take care of yourself and protect your body." And that billboard alone got people talking about it in the church. It just sits there and people look up and see it and say "wow, these people are really trying to do something." Think about if every radio station did that. But with deregulation they don't have to do that anymore, so they don't, because it takes space away from running paying commercials. So get rid of the public service announcements, get rid of all that community service stuff on Sunday so we can run commercials. You used to have to do so much [of that] to get your license, but now you don't have to do anything. They're not serving the community.
Cosmik: What advice do you have for Net radio programmers?
McCoy: Just keep it creative. Keep pushing the envelope, please. Do everything you always wanted to try. Stay within your vision, of course. If you have a vision for what you're trying to do, do it, but keep pushing the envelope. Throw out complacency. Lee Abrahms, the guy who's starting XM Radio, has a rule with his people: if they say three clichés in a meeting he fires them. So you've got people really thinking. They're not going to sit there and say the same stuff over and over again. I thought that was a great rule.
Cosmik: Do you think the envelope is without limit right now because there's no regulation on the Internet?
McCoy: Yeah, we don't need any regulation.
Cosmik: Do you see it coming?
McCoy: Eventually. There's going to be some. How can we get around it?
Cosmik: So how do you envision the future of online radio?
McCoy: I think it's going to be a diverse landscape with a true variety. I think that's where it's going to be, giving people lots of options, which I think is important. But I also think that somewhere along the line it may start paring down to where some of the smart people may start getting together, people who think alike, and start putting some great shows together.
Cosmik: You think some of the disenfranchised from the past of radio will be involved?
McCoy: Yeah, I think a lot of guys like me that got out because they couldn't do what they do best, which is astonishing listeners and performing on the radio like they used to, may turn up here doing this kind of stuff. And I'm sure they'll be welcome.
Cosmik: How can we help? What can we do to get it back?
McCoy: Listen. Look for it. Find it. It's all going to come together and work out. I'm really excited about this, because I've kind of given up on commercial radio seeing that they need to make these changes. They're way behind, and I think this is going to roll right over them.
© 2000 - DJ Johnson
Interested in listening to some good radio over the Internet? Be sure to visit our new link site, Radio Planet. You'll find links to all kinds of interesting stations there. Just because you live in a town that is a wasteland as far as radio is concerned doesn't mean you can't enjoy a great station in Austin, or St. Louis, or Australia for that matter. Have fun!